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AI Separation, how good?
48 replies to this topic
Posted 04 August 2008 - 05:36 PM
>I just fly the "published" STAR anyway when cleared for>vectors to ILS,or other approach, by FS9 ATC (don't try this>in the real world).>When ATC gives you headings to fly just acknowledge them so>that you won't be kicked out of the system, ie-"IFR flight>plan cancelled", etc,etc., but do not fly the headings given.>Fly the STAR as it appears on your GPS. Then when you near the>approach final fix you will be cleared for the appropriate>approach (ILS, VOR,etc) as you enter within 30* of the runway>center line. No more 50 mile vectors to final and, best of>all, it's free.I do exactly the same thing and it works fine. However from time to time it would add to the realism to get a few vectors from ATC(listen to KJFK on liveatc, you'll understand what I mean) . I guess there is no option but to go online for that.:-roll
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Posted 04 August 2008 - 03:56 PM
I've been using AI Smooth for ages but based on some of the comments in this thread, I decided to give AI Separation another go. I'm also a user of Traffic View Board, which allows me to see just what's going on with AI and after doing a couple of flights, it appears AI Separation gets more arrival traffic down on the ground. And no unwanted behavior so far.
Posted 04 August 2008 - 12:08 PM
I just fly the "published" STAR anyway when cleared for vectors to ILS,or other approach, by FS9 ATC (don't try this in the real world).When ATC gives you headings to fly just acknowledge them so that you won't be kicked out of the system, ie-"IFR flight plan cancelled", etc,etc., but do not fly the headings given. Fly the STAR as it appears on your GPS. Then when you near the approach final fix you will be cleared for the appropriate approach (ILS, VOR,etc) as you enter within 30* of the runway center line. No more 50 mile vectors to final and, best of all, it's free.
Posted 03 August 2008 - 09:43 AM
>No, Dirk98, neither prevent that but they do seem to make it>better, probably more by accident than design. And as I as>once told over at the RC forum, the pilot is responsible for>all cross traffic, just like real life. ;-) Ever since I>found that out and made sure I monitored the traffic situation>both in the air and during taxi on the ground, I haven't had a>single plane crash into me!>>BTW, I've had crash detection off almost from the beginning. >Too many add on on sceneries to be bothered.So which one of the two are you using with RC?Thanks for the answer, Trelane.Dirk.
Posted 03 August 2008 - 06:53 AM
No, Dirk98, neither prevent that but they do seem to make it better, probably more by accident than design. And as I as once told over at the RC forum, the pilot is responsible for all cross traffic, just like real life. ;-) Ever since I found that out and made sure I monitored the traffic situation both in the air and during taxi on the ground, I haven't had a single plane crash into me!BTW, I've had crash detection off almost from the beginning. Too many add on on sceneries to be bothered.
Posted 03 August 2008 - 06:06 AM
DO AI Smooth/AI Separation prevent (or merely improve at least) other aircrafts to run over you or ram into your plane when taxiing on the ground with RC4? That's what mostly happens here, and I had to check "Ignore crashes and damage" in the Realism Settings due to this.Thanks.
Posted 01 August 2008 - 04:32 PM
It's not complicated but messy. The options are:Go into each winwood folder and with a .wav editor crop and save the .wav as city.wav. This preserved the accent of each controller and pilot voice -- lot's of them :) This preserves the original .wav. If your not fussy, just create one city.wav and paste it into the other winwood folders.Then go into the script folder. Then go into the pilot scripts folder and open city-ireland.txt file and make the contents just "city". Do the same in the controller scripts folder.Option 3 is a little messier :)Create the city.wav as described above for each winwood folder.Have some wake-up refreshment after all of that. Create using notepad in the pilot and controller scripts folder a city.txt file with the word "city" in each.Open in a text editor only, not a spread sheet editor, the c4.csv file (back it up first!!!!) in the data folder. Replace in several spots city-ireland with city. These are associated with cityjet. Remember to save in .txt format. I think that will do it. Make sure you can retrieve the original back-up c4.csv file just in case.
Posted 01 August 2008 - 08:26 AM
Menno, I fly a lot of different airlines all over the world and when I can't find the proper call sign I don't sweat it so much. The default ATC has far, far more inaccuracies than that so I'm perfectly willing to cut RC 4 a tiny bit of slack with that one.Can't you record the proper call sign yourself and replace the .wav files inside the RC folder until JD get done with teh 150,000 other little details he has to do and we get a new, smoother RC5 -- that's maybe still compatible with FS9? (JD-If you're reading this, hint, hint.)
Posted 01 August 2008 - 02:57 AM
Chuck, I agree with you that RC is a very good program. Still, I haven't been using it for a while.Reason? RC reads the callsign 'City' as 'City Ireland'. 'City' is used by KLM City Hoppers and as I use to fly out of Amsterdam there are usually quite a lot of movements by these planes. However RC uses the callsigh 'City Ireland', which is used by a French company operating between France and Ireland. I have informed JD of this and he told me it will be fixed in a new release, but I find it annoying it cannot be fixed with a software update in the meantime.So, yes, in general I agree with, but I would like to see more updates in the meantime to add and correct callsigns.Menno
Posted 31 July 2008 - 09:00 PM
This is the AI Smooth developer's site:http://www.sg-flightware.de/The server was down at the time of writing this but it is up and down. This way you can check on the latest version.Taxi-speed is one of the controls in FS9 Configurator. You can get it from the author's site:http://kensalter.com/downloads/or from the file library here as:fs9cfg16.zipwhich is the last version.
Posted 30 July 2008 - 07:08 PM
ehmmmmm, where to start =D?AIsmooth & AiseparationI use both, they both are good and in diferent ways controling AI aircrafts... So when one bugs me, i start onother one and circul goes round...AIsmooth have great option reduce speed on final, but when i check it, AI start flying at 50 Knots =DAiseparation, sometimes unexplainable freezes for 5-10 minutes... BTW, one guy sayed that have AIsmooth 1.12... Where You find it? I know 1.11a and then 1.20... I would like to try, becouse atm no of this 2 not fully work..Radar ContactIt so danm good, that without comments...About TAXI speed...I never was edit it, but maybe should I: once in missoury with addon airport and UT Ai traffic from parking to takeoff take 47 minutes =D - my longest takeoff, even with allmost half of them was disapeared becouse of delay... ech, tx speed would not help, it takeoff/landigs is so danm slow.. Anyone know tool for that?But isnt airplanes have diferent taxi speeds? Some time i just run FS for AI traffic watch if i'm busy and when checking for AI bugs, and some airports in parallel taxis taxiing 2 planes close to each other and in diferent speeds (about 5 knots diference)Or it depends in wich airport it is (AFCAD?)?Sorry for language, this time quite hard was to writeLimo
Posted 30 July 2008 - 06:30 PM
There is a window of "flight departure delays" allowed in FS so the late gate departures are playing catch-up in the mad rush.What you can do to thin down the massive take-off queue that can develop is to use AI Separation or AI Smooth to space out arrivals, also being bunched up in a late arriving window, thereby giving an opportunity for AI to depart between arrivals.Another thing you can do is use FS9 Configurator by Ken Salter which has a way to modify the taxi speed of ground AI. Increase it just a bit so AI exit the runways faster and exited AI are not clogging the taxiways in the exit path but don't increase the taxi speed too much or it will look strange with a fast choppy motion and other strange effects of an unrealistic fast taxi speed.
Posted 30 July 2008 - 06:10 PM
BTW, if you (like most of us) have been vectored into la-la-land* by FS ATC, you don't have to worry about that anymore.*I personally have been given a "follow runway heading" initally, and then got no further instructions from ATC for over 50 miles.
Posted 30 July 2008 - 06:07 PM
Don't want to sound like a shill, but RC4 is the BOMB.Like you, I initially resisted RC4's price, being a "casual" flyer. However, after becoming disgusted with FS's IFR protocol. If you fly IFR even part-time, it's worth the price. You get realistic handoffs, so that you can maintain a smooth ascent. You are not always vectored to an ILS approach just because. You can request full published instrument approaches instead of just relying on ATC vectors. Realistic descent profiles. And, it's nice to hand-off comms and controls to "otto" for a break on long flights. I am notoriously cheap, and FS Passengers and RC4 are the ONLY payware I have.
Posted 30 July 2008 - 07:31 AM
>I've often wondered when opening FS at your selected airport>(I have over 200 WOAI airlines), I get an immediatge rush (5>to 10 or more) of AI taxing to the active(s). AI must be on a>retroactive clock!:-lol , yeah, it's kinda funny, I just did a KORD-KATL, as soon as I started at KORD, there was this frenzy of departure. It settles down in 10-15 minutes though.
Posted 30 July 2008 - 06:47 AM
Mike:"The limitation at busy airports with RC4 is the already mentioned ground traffic, and also one still finds the massive backups for takeoff with numerous go-arounds for the AI."I've often wondered when opening FS at your selected airport (I have over 200 WOAI airlines), I get an immediatge rush (5 to 10 or more) of AI taxing to the active(s). AI must be on a retroactive clock!Ronzie:I will download the manual and give it a read. 90% of my flying is commercial so perhaps RC4 is something I could handle.ThanksChris
Posted 29 July 2008 - 05:38 PM
One advantage of RC is that if you are in error you will get nagged but it will not cancel your IFR unless you request it.It depends how casual you are. If you are fairly frequentin IFR flying enough to learn and retain the techniques, and you are patient, then RC might fit you. Click on my tag below to take you to their web site. You'll see a section on who Radar Contact is suited for. You can download the big .pdf manual from the documentation page which by itself contains tutorial material so you can judge if you are prepared for the IFR environment. You will also find a features comparative table to view there between the earliest versions and the current version.
Posted 29 July 2008 - 06:27 AM
RC4 is definitely a "must-have" for me. I fly almost 98% IFR flight plans and another big plus is the way it handles the AI situation. I've had only one commanded go-around from RC on approach in over 2 years. It was unexpected therefore "fun". Flying into KEWR or KORD works well in RC4. The limitation at busy airports with RC4 is the already mentioned ground traffic, and also one still finds the massive backups for takeoff with numerous go-arounds for the AI. It seems to me all that is needed is some tweaking of the internal FS AI engine. A major disappointment for me was that this was ignored in FSX. AI adds so much realism to the sim experience. Mike
Posted 28 July 2008 - 12:09 PM
I don't think either program was ever meant to "control" AI -- I know that AI Smooth is meant to simply vector AI off as you make an approach and create fewer go arounds for the user. And that it dies well.Radar Control? Do you mean Radar Contact? If you mean the latter, Radar Contact is designed to "freeze" AI traffic after you're cleared to land or cleared to take off. Be advised there is no ground control with RC, so you have to watch cross traffic while taxiing, but most of the time the situation you describe is eliminated. I say "most of the time" because AI traffic is still goverened by each airline's flight plan and scheduling an depending on how much you run with, you may still find conflicts -- just like real life. In any event I highly, HIGHLY recommend Radar CONTACT. I held off buying it for a long time because I was intimidated but when i was finally ready, it did not disappoint. I can't fly withuot it.If you're NOT referring to Radar Contact, never mine. :-)
Posted 28 July 2008 - 07:58 AM
Using AI Smooth and receiving permission from ATC to "Taxi into position and Hold" at KBOS 33L, I was granted permission to take off. ATC alerted me to both landing AC on 4L and departing AC on 4R, both of which intersect 33L. Had I elected to take off at the moment ATC gave me permission, I would have come awfully close to a collision with AI AC on both 4L & 4R. Had I waited much longer, I had an arriving AC on 33L which probably would have been given a "go around".Question: Is either AI Smooth or AI Separation able to control this sort of activity so ATC gives me the correct (and safe) instructions to converging AC, or would I have to consider Radar Control to accomplish this?ThanksChris
Posted 27 July 2008 - 01:52 PM
I run AI Smooth 1.12 and I've been seeing a lot of slewing lately -- at least 1 every other flight. A lot meaning more than I saw with v1.11, which never seemed to slew.I don't have AI Separation installed -- Has anyone else seen AI Smooth exhibit this behavior at all?