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UT2 callsigns and RC


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49 replies to this topic

#1 jd

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 07:16 AM

Would have been nice if ut2 folks had used the same atc names between products. at least that appears to be the problem.regardless, it's probably easier to fix the problem in RC than it is in UT2Open c4.csv file with notepadAdd the following 3 linesAMERICANAIRLINES,american,,0, 0UNITEDAIRLINES,united,,0, 0SKYWESTAIRLINES,skywest,,0, 0If there are others, we'll have to do them one at a timejd

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#2 Petraeus

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 12:20 PM

Would have been nice if ut2 folks had used the same atc names between products. at least that appears to be the problem.regardless, it's probably easier to fix the problem in RC than it is in UT2Open c4.csv file with notepadAdd the following 3 linesAMERICANAIRLINES,american,,0, 0UNITEDAIRLINES,united,,0, 0SKYWESTAIRLINES,skywest,,0, 0If there are others, we'll have to do them one at a timejd

Thanks to all involved in tracking that one down.
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#3 blackforce

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 05:36 PM

Would have been nice if ut2 folks had used the same atc names between products. at least that appears to be the problem.regardless, it's probably easier to fix the problem in RC than it is in UT2Open c4.csv file with notepadAdd the following 3 linesAMERICANAIRLINES,american,,0, 0UNITEDAIRLINES,united,,0, 0SKYWESTAIRLINES,skywest,,0, 0If there are others, we'll have to do them one at a timejd

and were is this file at? i don't see a cvs file, and also add jetblue too the list, thanks

#4 ronzie

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 06:48 PM

It's under your rcv4 (or whatever you named it) folder in the data folder under it. Remember, use notepad. not excel or other spreadsheet nor database editor. Make a safety copy of it before you edit it. The "c" stands for "carrier".

and were is this file at? i don't see a cvs file, and also add jetblue too the list, thanks


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#5 nrunning24

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 07:35 PM

Today I've been going to airports and trying to find more callsigns that can be updated. Below is all the callsigns that i have added. FYI for Shuttle America I made it skywest because shuttle america does not exist in RC4.3, but both have similar planes and are part of United. If anyone know of other callsigns that are mispronounced and wants help changing them let me know what they are and I can track down how UT2 names it incorrectly. Make sure you back up your old file before editing it.AMERICANAIRLINES,american,,0, 0 UNITEDAIRLINES,united,,0, 0 SKYWESTAIRLINES,skywest,,0, 0 USAIRWAYS,US AIR,,0, 0 AMERICANEAGLE,eagleflight,,0, 0 Spiritairlines,spiritwings,,0, 0 JetblueAirways,JET BLUE,,0, 0 ShuttleAmerica,skywest,,0, 0 bmiBritishMidland,MIDLAND,,0, 0 QatarAirways,QATARI,,0, 0 bmiRegional,baby,,0, 0 FreedomAirlines,LIBERTY,,0, 0 MexicanaDeAviacion,MEXICANA,,0, 0 CroatiaAirlines,CROATIA,,0, 0MalevHungarianAirlines,MALEV,,0, 0
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#6 Subs

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 09:43 PM

Today I've been going to airports and trying to find more callsigns that can be updated. Below is all the callsigns that i have added. FYI for Shuttle America I made it skywest because shuttle america does not exist in RC4.3, but both have similar planes and are part of United. If anyone know of other callsigns that are mispronounced and wants help changing them let me know what they are and I can track down how UT2 names it incorrectly. Make sure you back up your old file before editing it.AMERICANAIRLINES,american,,0, 0 UNITEDAIRLINES,united,,0, 0 SKYWESTAIRLINES,skywest,,0, 0 USAIRWAYS,US AIR,,0, 0 AMERICANEAGLE,eagleflight,,0, 0 Spiritairlines,spiritwings,,0, 0 JetblueAirways,JET BLUE,,0, 0 ShuttleAmerica,skywest,,0, 0 bmiBritishMidland,MIDLAND,,0, 0 QatarAirways,QATARI,,0, 0 bmiRegional,baby,,0, 0 FreedomAirlines,LIBERTY,,0, 0 MexicanaDeAviacion,MEXICANA,,0, 0 CroatiaAirlines,CROATIA,,0, 0MalevHungarianAirlines,MALEV,,0, 0

Thanks for keeping this list and thread going. We'll keep an eye on it and make the relevant changes in RCv5.Subs

#7 nrunning24

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 10:28 PM

No problem, I would rather do it now and enjoy RCv5 when it comes out. I just don't understand how come some work and some don't. I was at KSEA at almost all the Alaska planes were not working while all of the southwest ones were, and them once I was almost satisfied that there was just a problem with Alaska and not Southwest, an Alaska plane was pronounced correctly and a Southwest was not. To make matters more complicated all of the aircraft.cfg's that i have checked have the correct callsign. It seems to me that for one reason or another(maybe because its a diffrent kind of traffic program that doesn't use a bgl but "injects" traffic into the sim) some of the callsigns are changed from the cfg verson while others keep it. who knows, so i would rather put in the small amount of time putting the other callsigns into rc4 than flying around with all the other aircraft being called tango, uniform, alpha etc.
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#8 Petraeus

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 03:14 AM

Is it worthwhile making the last bit of this thread a 'sticky'? Especially if this list is going to grow over time.
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#9 Subs

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 06:06 AM

No problem, I would rather do it now and enjoy RCv5 when it comes out. I just don't understand how come some work and some don't. I was at KSEA at almost all the Alaska planes were not working while all of the southwest ones were, and them once I was almost satisfied that there was just a problem with Alaska and not Southwest, an Alaska plane was pronounced correctly and a Southwest was not. To make matters more complicated all of the aircraft.cfg's that i have checked have the correct callsign. It seems to me that for one reason or another(maybe because its a diffrent kind of traffic program that doesn't use a bgl but "injects" traffic into the sim) some of the callsigns are changed from the cfg verson while others keep it. who knows, so i would rather put in the small amount of time putting the other callsigns into rc4 than flying around with all the other aircraft being called tango, uniform, alpha etc.

I know what you mean - this is the same process we go though day after day during the development of every new version of RC. What happens is that RC determines what it should call a particular AI purely from the information it receives. If the information it receives is wrong, then RC can do nothing but in turn output the incorrect information. As jd says: "Garbage In, Garbage Out". In RCv5 particularly, we have worked on providing a 'solution', which even though isn't perfect, can help to (at least try to) eliminate some these types of problems.In this particular case with United, the actual real world callsign is UNITED. That is known and accepted, but UT2 for some reason has it labeled as UNITED AIRLINES. Unfortunately in computer-speak, UNITED and UNITED AIRLINES are two different things. Having said that, UT's position has to be respected as they have included thousands of airlines in the package and believe me, it is virtually impossible to get every single one correct.As a real world example, we had a Omni Air Intl DC-10 transit though Brisbane earlier in the week - it arrived using the callsign OMNI AIR, but when it departed later that evening it used OSCAR ALPHA ECHO. To replicate that level of detail in FS by getting ALL addons to match up is not possible.So what you're hearing in RC are unexpected variations in what RC thinks should be the callsign (UNITED), versus what UT2 has actually called your UAL planes (UNITED AIRLINES).I hope this helps in understanding why the error occurred, but hopefully with jd's modifications (it's like teaching RC about UT2's incorrect callsigns), the AI should now be called more correctly.Subs

#10 blackforce

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 02:02 PM

It's under your rcv4 (or whatever you named it) folder in the data folder under it. Remember, use notepad. not excel or other spreadsheet nor database editor. Make a safety copy of it before you edit it. The "c" stands for "carrier".

hey thank you for the help.

#11 nrunning24

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 03:32 PM

I know what you mean - this is the same process we go though day after day during the development of every new version of RC. What happens is that RC determines what it should call a particular AI purely from the information it receives. If the information it receives is wrong, then RC can do nothing but in turn output the incorrect information. As jd says: "Garbage In, Garbage Out". In RCv5 particularly, we have worked on providing a 'solution', which even though isn't perfect, can help to (at least try to) eliminate some these types of problems.In this particular case with United, the actual real world callsign is UNITED. That is known and accepted, but UT2 for some reason has it labeled as UNITED AIRLINES. Unfortunately in computer-speak, UNITED and UNITED AIRLINES are two different things. Having said that, UT's position has to be respected as they have included thousands of airlines in the package and believe me, it is virtually impossible to get every single one correct.As a real world example, we had a Omni Air Intl DC-10 transit though Brisbane earlier in the week - it arrived using the callsign OMNI AIR, but when it departed later that evening it used OSCAR ALPHA ECHO. To replicate that level of detail in FS by getting ALL addons to match up is not possible.So what you're hearing in RC are unexpected variations in what RC thinks should be the callsign (UNITED), versus what UT2 has actually called your UAL planes (UNITED AIRLINES).I hope this helps in understanding why the error occurred, but hopefully with jd's modifications (it's like teaching RC about UT2's incorrect callsigns), the AI should now be called more correctly.Subs

Yea I understand how RC is interpreting the information its getting. And actually the problem with United makes a lot of sense to me because it was always pronounced wrong. I took a couple of programming classes in college so i have a basic understanding of whats going on. What I'm confused on is the planes that work only sometimes. Seems to me that each airline(or maybe just each individual plane) should work or not, and not flip back and forth. It's no big deal though, I've just started making a log each time I fly a flight and at the end going through and seeing if anything needs to be changed. I think that after a few flights in each region that I fly most I should have caught all the bad ones. Seems like I got most of Europe done, my last flight only had one that didn't work and the rest were just flights whose callsign is not recorded in RC.Also updated list of new lines to add to your c4.csv:AlaskaAirlines,ALASKA,,0, 0 SouthwestAirlines,SOUTHWEST,,0, 0 KLM-RoyalDutchAirlines,KLM,,0, 0
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#12 jd

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Posted 01 August 2009 - 08:11 AM

Yea I understand how RC is interpreting the information its getting. And actually the problem with United makes a lot of sense to me because it was always pronounced wrong. I took a couple of programming classes in college so i have a basic understanding of whats going on. What I'm confused on is the planes that work only sometimes. Seems to me that each airline(or maybe just each individual plane) should work or not, and not flip back and forth. It's no big deal though, I've just started making a log each time I fly a flight and at the end going through and seeing if anything needs to be changed. I think that after a few flights in each region that I fly most I should have caught all the bad ones. Seems like I got most of Europe done, my last flight only had one that didn't work and the rest were just flights whose callsign is not recorded in RC.Also updated list of new lines to add to your c4.csv:AlaskaAirlines,ALASKA,,0, 0 SouthwestAirlines,SOUTHWEST,,0, 0 KLM-RoyalDutchAirlines,KLM,,0, 0

the answer is, sometimes i see xyz and sometimes i see xyzairlines. i can handle xyz, xyzairlines doesn't compute.it would be nice if ALL the AI people would settle on a common, consistant, universal naming convention. would make my life easier. that's probably not near the top of their list of things to do :-(jd

#13 FlyinMisfit

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Posted 02 August 2009 - 12:53 PM

why can't the UT folks fix the prob. themselves?imho, that's un-acceptable for what their charging for UT2.happy flyin, FM

#14 Petraeus

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Posted 03 August 2009 - 03:15 AM

Yea I understand how RC is interpreting the information its getting. And actually the problem with United makes a lot of sense to me because it was always pronounced wrong. I took a couple of programming classes in college so i have a basic understanding of whats going on. What I'm confused on is the planes that work only sometimes. Seems to me that each airline(or maybe just each individual plane) should work or not, and not flip back and forth. It's no big deal though, I've just started making a log each time I fly a flight and at the end going through and seeing if anything needs to be changed. I think that after a few flights in each region that I fly most I should have caught all the bad ones. Seems like I got most of Europe done, my last flight only had one that didn't work and the rest were just flights whose callsign is not recorded in RC.Also updated list of new lines to add to your c4.csv:AlaskaAirlines,ALASKA,,0, 0 SouthwestAirlines,SOUTHWEST,,0, 0 KLM-RoyalDutchAirlines,KLM,,0, 0

Thanks for fixing KLM. I noticed there was a problem with a 737 yesterday, but when I looked through the aircraft.cfg's everything seemed OK. So are these long names being injected by UT2 somehow?I suspect there's a problem with Frontier, (lots of 'Foxtrot' at Denver), although I couldn't see anything wrong with the .cfg's, but if UT2 is inserting something then that would explain it.
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#15 Pete Dowson

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Posted 03 August 2009 - 04:22 AM

Thanks for fixing KLM. I noticed there was a problem with a 737 yesterday, but when I looked through the aircraft.cfg's everything seemed OK. So are these long names being injected by UT2 somehow?I suspect there's a problem with Frontier, (lots of 'Foxtrot' at Denver), although I couldn't see anything wrong with the .cfg's, but if UT2 is inserting something then that would explain it.

There's actually no facilities in SimConnect for setting the ATC AIRLINE string -- this really must be coming from the Aircraft.CFG file for that specific aircraft. SimConnect provides facilities only for the tail number and the ATC FLIGHT NUMBER to be set individually, when an AI aircraft in created, whether parked (with a flight plan provided later) or airborne (already with a flight plan).However, just looking only at the 737's in the SimObjects\UT2 Aircraft folders installed by UT2 (73G, 73H, etc) I see:atc_airline=NONEfor all of them!So, what I think UT2's run-time component is doing is(1) creating the Flight plan files on-the-fly, in its specific flight plans folder (actually we know it does this already), and(2) editing the AIRCRAFT.CFG file, incorporating the specific "atc_airline" name into it just before is sends the creation request to SimConnect.When UT2 is not running, the flight plans aren't there and all the atc_airlines are reading NONE again.So, it is getting its airline names from elsewhere. I think it will be its SQlite database files, stored in the Flight One Software\Ultimate Traffic 2 folder (in Users\<logonname>\AppData\Roaming on Vista and Win7, but in the Documents and Settings equivalent on XP).[LATER]Yup! Found it. They are all in an SQLite database file called "UT2Interface.db".They should provide some facilities for users to edit this, shouldn't they? Alternatively, if JD or anybody has any SQLite tools and know how to use them, maybe there's a way to generate updates to RC's CSV file automatically, from the database? Or it might be worth approaching the UT2 folks for cooperation in doing this?RegardsPete





   
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