Add-On Future with MS Flight

[OwenHewitt 0]

I posted a new blog entry giving my prediction of how MS Flight will impact the 3rd party developers. Care to give it a read and comment? MS Flight Add-On Store?Regards,Owen

[Highmike 68]

This will be a bomb shell Owen, thanks for sharing.Say Owen, are you still a MS MVP? I'm wondering if MS has kept you in the loop so to speak.

[MatthewS 761]

My thoughts:-Good for developers

• Massive exposure to Flight customer base
• Reduction in piracy (probably)
• MS commission is probably same (or less) than traditional flightsim stores

Good for customers

• Easy to access store from within Flight
• Easy installation and updating of add-ons
• Product ratings/comments should help users when making purchasing decisions
• Ability to re-download purchases from the store (at no cost)
• Successful marketplace should mean more add-ons will be developed

Bad for existing flightsim stores

• I guess most purchases will happen via the Flight marketplace and not the traditional flightsim stores

[N2056 33]

Owen, thanks for the insight. What you have said pretty much lines up with what I have been hearing, and to me means two things...1. I won't be getting it. FSX currently gives me a good enough "experience". I can already build whatever I want in FSX, and I'm not going through another learning curve requiring me to use cryptic SDKs that ultimately require many hours in the design forums working with others to figure out how things really work. 2. Freeware most likely won't exist as FSX already weeded out a lot of authors. Making the job harder won't fix that, and unless there is some provision for them that eliminates the "QC" check and any possible fees to host freeware ultimately the sim as we know it is doomed. This would also include a situation where MS allows a feeless upload but then still charges a fee for the end-user to aquire said freeware. Frankly freeware types got this hobby to where it is, and while I really hope I am wrong I see this as the direction FS is going.Think about it...without the grass roots freeware folks working together to build up the hobby over the years you would not have very many Payware houses around, not to mention new versions of the sim. How do you think those Payware guys got started?To give some idea of where I am coming from...I've been flying the sim from the original version that played on an Apple II computer, and I've been modeling since the original Flight Shop came out in the mid '90s.

[HughesMDflyer4 470]

I think we should just pray that Owen's article is incorrect. I can't imagine FS without developers! :(

[Kosta 122]

I hope for everyone's sake that is wrong. It's correct everything that has been said, but not keeping it open, and letting MS manage it would restrict things too much.They blog said something about MS not allowing buggy stuff to come one - if you think MS is going to be thoroughly checking each and every addon, be that freeware or payware, then you must be kidding. See only how many addons now are readily available, and just through users, errors can be found. MS is not capable of that, nor having interest in that.They also won't be interested into keeping buggy software. So I think so middle way will have to be found.I don't believe they will make a closed Marketplace. There probably is going to be a Marketplace, but other stores are going to coexist with it. Developers will have a chance to offer their addons via Marketplace additionally.

[MatthewS 761]

I really doubt that Flight add-ons will only be available from within the Flight Marketplace. IMO you will still be able to install add-ons via zip file or .EXE, so freeware via sites like AVSIM etc will still survive/prosper.Flight Marketplace will be the preeminent source for payware add-ons.

[ahuimanu 50]

I agree with your premise and analysis completely.To the point of freeware, a Flight marketplace does NOT preclude freeware. Further, there is a chance that the SDKs will actually improve and introduce simplicity through greater abstraction.

[OwenHewitt 0]

This will be a bomb shell Owen, thanks for sharing.Say Owen, are you still a MS MVP? I'm wondering if MS has kept you in the loop so to speak.

No sir, I'm no longer a MS MVP but I have maintained contact with a few of the folks who remained to work on Flight from the former ACES team. I have not been given any specific information regarding this topic and it is pure speculation at this moment, but my gut tells me this is indeed the direction that MS is going with their software, especially firmed up with the press release mentioned in a previous thread.Regards,Owen

I think we should just pray that Owen's article is incorrect. I can't imagine FS without developers! :(

There will still be a place for "grassroots" developers I believe. Much like the situation with the Apple app store ... there are tons of apps there that are first time endeavors and tons of free ones as well. We'll have to see what the plan is when things become more concrete in the future.Regards,Owen

My thoughts:-Good for developers

• Massive exposure to Flight customer base
• Reduction in piracy (probably)
• MS commission is probably same (or less) than traditional flightsim stores

Good for customers

• Easy to access store from within Flight
• Easy installation and updating of add-ons
• Product ratings/comments should help users when making purchasing decisions
• Ability to re-download purchases from the store (at no cost)
• Successful marketplace should mean more add-ons will be developed

Bad for existing flightsim stores

• I guess most purchases will happen via the Flight marketplace and not the traditional flightsim stores

The mention of reduction in piracy is a pretty valuable one for developers such as myself. I cringe when I do a search for a colleague's project on google to find that it has appeared in some pirate warez site or something of the like.Regards,Owen

[mmann 72]

The comment "heavily buggy products will probably not be allowed on the store" is interesting. If that criteria had existed a few years ago, both the original FSX and Vista releases would not have occurred!!Regards, Mike Mann

[alainneedle1 97]

Owen, you'r the man, when I tried to explain the same thing as you just did starting here at the bottom of the first page.... http://forum.avsim.n...rumors-to-rest/ some simmers looked at me like I had 3 heads......you sir can read.I went a little further than you about my predictions but so far A +1 for you.@ everybody, if you think that payware dev. were not in the loop with MS from the beginning I have 10 acres of land to sell 50 miles west of Boca Raton Florida....real cheap.....

[Guest veeray]

There's the little matter of the law getting in the way.. if Microsoft abuses their store and makes it the only portal given the numerous ones available, then we can all join in the class action lawsuit and acuse them of price fixing or market manipulation.... any FS lawyers around? EA tried to do something similar with the NFL licensing, so they would be the only vendor. The courts are about to hear the case.

[alainneedle1 97]

Is't it the US goverment who tried to dismantle Microsoft?I'm wondering if Microsoft lost money here.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft

[dmaher 0]

I strongly suspect that this will be the only portal in which 3rd party applications will be obtained for use with MS Flight.

The only factor that concerns me is an ‘open market’ may conflict with company policy dictated by other MS games.Otherwise there is no upside that would suggest to me a locked market is likely.It would be considerably more practical and profitable for the Live Marketplace to be the ‘best source’ rather than the ‘only source’.If Flight excluded existing FS libraries, publishers, and other distribution it would generate a tsunami of ill will.Their biggest risk is the developers and hardcore audience not leaving FSX, or worse migrating to X-plane.That’s not at all improbable.If MS closed the existing free market and libraries I suspect X-plane numbers would rival Flight in a few short years.The hardcore audience drives opinion and the casual audience follows.I’m sure MS is well aware of the relationship and implications.I don't imagine they see their franchise as invulnerable.The marketplace needs content...it needs the on-going cooperation and confidence of experienced developers to thrive.That extends to freeware. N2056 says there's no viable commercial development without freeware and I agree.As I see it the alternatives are.

• 100% of an anemic store and a shrinking audience.
• 50% (++) of a vibrant store and a growing audience.

The smart-phone/console model (hardware locked) isn’t a very good analogy for a PC game -IMO.I think people see dollar signs in their eyes ;) and imagine it can be applied here.But it wouldn’t take much to send the golden goose packing with such a ham-handed strategy.Live Marketplace has a lot going for it. It will attract enthusiastic customers and developers without any coercion.

[OwenHewitt 0]

The only factor that concerns me is an ‘open market’ may conflict with policy dictated by other MS games - because there is no other upside for locking this market.It would be considerably more practical and profitable for the Marketplace to be the ‘best store’ rather than the ‘only store’.If Flight excluded existing FS libraries, publishers, and other distribution it would generate a tsunami of ill will.Their biggest risk is the developers and hardcore audience migrating to X-plane.That’s not at all improbable.If MS closed the existing free market and libraries I suspect the X-plane numbers would rival Flight in a few short years.The hardcore audience drives opinion and the casual audience follows.I’m sure MS is well aware of the implications…and they don’t see their franchise as invulnerable.The marketplace needs content...it needs the on-going cooperation of experienced developers to thrive.That extends to freeware. There is no viable commercial development without freeware.The alternatives are.

• 100% of an anemic store and a shrinking audience.
• 50% (++) of a vibrant store and a growing audience.

The smart-phone/console model (hardware locked) isn’t a very good analogy for a PC game.I think people see dollar signs in their eyes ;) and imagine it can be applied here.But it wouldn’t take much to send the golden goose packing with such a ham-handed strategy.The Live Marketplace has a lot going for it. It will attract enthusiastic customers and developers without coercion.

Perhaps I am comparing apples to oranges in the broad scheme of things, but as a developer, I am very interested in the idea of security being tightened with such a Marketplace. Either you get it from there or don't get it at all. I agree that it would probably not be in the best interest to make this portal the exclusive place to obtain expansions, especially those that are freely offered. But again, this is all pure speculation and I'm sure we'll learn the specifics soon enough. I appreciate the civil and well supported arguments on this discussion.Regards,Owen