Most Dangerous NGX Approaches and Departures

[pete_auau 1,158]

If there is a working copilot on board, you will be staying in the back. Unless you mean you brought your own...

very funny :(

[Daniel choen 23]

Sorry, this is just a lot of nonsense.Fabo is right, you are not.If it was so easy a 'dedictated' and experienced simmer would show up at a local flight school and pretty much could start/land on his own in the first couple of hours. And we know it is not true - they still need your typical 10-15 hrs before they are even able to properly handle a lowely Cesna 152 and perform a solo flight.

not correct, i am 16 and flew in a cessna the pilot gave me the controls for about 15 minutes, handled it without any problem at all, the pilot was a friend of my dad, but it can show that i had no problem to fly it after 3 years experience with vatsim and NGX, and BTW did you ever been in a cockpit and didn't immediately recognized all the system?again i hope you will take it as a friendly argument, i don't want it to go further then that, but wanted to clear my point. Edited January 13, 2012 by Daniel choen

[ZKOKQ 984]

If the two pilots mentioned were female and had heart attacks, I would give them "Mouth to Mouth", oh yeah.... if they were male pilots, I would say "Thank you for flying United "

[pete_auau 1,158]

not correct, i am 16 and flew in a cessna the pilot gave me the controls for about 15 minutes, handled it without any problem at all, the pilot was a friend of my dad, but it can show that i had no problem to fly it after 3 years experience with vatsim and NGX, and BTW did you ever been in a cockpit and didn't immediately recognized all the system?again i hope you will take it as a friendly argument, i don't want it to go further then that, but wanted to clear my point.

Its abit different if the co pilot there next to you telling you what to do etc it be a different story if you were alone and u had a failure of some kind than see how would you react to the situation.

[Jalio 4]

If the two pilots mentioned were female and had heart attacks, I would give them "Mouth to Mouth", oh yeah.... if they were male pilots, I would say "Thank you for flying United "

Hahaha, actually made me laugh :(

[Andy10r 0]

not correct, i am 16 and flew in a cessna the pilot gave me the controls for about 15 minutes, handled it without any problem at all, the pilot was a friend of my dad, but it can show that i had no problem to fly it after 3 years experience with vatsim and NGX, and BTW did you ever been in a cockpit and didn't immediately recognized all the system?again i hope you will take it as a friendly argument, i don't want it to go further then that, but wanted to clear my point.

Flying a cessna already in the air for 15 mins is a lot different to what the guys are talking about dude......Its one thing recognising the systems but to do all the good stuff and then working out all the correct speeds/flap settings....on your own....VERY difficult. But I bet there would be a few that could do a good job if it was "last chance saloon". I've flown gliders for 20 years and know I would struggle in a situation like that but always wonder.Andy

[scandinavian13 5,192]

I think I kinda opened up a can of worms here, and I'll attempt to cut it back down some.My point was that you shouldn't dismiss the idea that a sim 'pilot' could ever pull through in an impossible Airplane-style situation like that. That is all. Would I give them a license? Nope. Why? As mentioned, there's a lot more to it than being able to fly. There's the knowledge of the FARs, the AIM, fundamentals of flight, ATC basics, and so on, before even getting your private.Again, my point was that I'd argue some in the sim 'pilot' group could pull it off. I didn't say they'd pull it off well, or that we should just instantly certify sim 'pilots' with thousands of sim hours.Any sim pilot who wants to prove his/her stuff, even in as small of a plane as a Cessna is welcome to meet me at JYO for a run at it. I have 100% faith that you can pull it off, but I can nearly guarantee it won't be as good as someone who's flown outside the sim before.There's a difference between being able to do it, and being able to do it safely, and that's generally made up in the difference of experience and impassioned study.

Edited January 13, 2012 by scandinavian13

[Benjamin J 751]

I'll have to go with Toncontin MHTG on this one. By far the most difficult approach I have done to date. The o0nly reaosn I have never crashed with the PMDG 737NGX is the HUD. That thing is insanely useful during that approach. When i tried it for the first time I used the Aerosoft Airbus X. Let's say that only at the third try did I manage to land on the runway and come to a stop before the end of the runway. last time I did it with the PMDG 737NGX I added a 16kts crosswind and did it by night. I tell ya: if not for the HUD, I would have probably crashed. I should really do it without now though, now that I'm getting more comfortable with the approach.

[Daniel choen 23]

I think I kinda opened up a can of worms here, and I'll attempt to cut it back down some.My point was that you shouldn't dismiss the idea that a sim 'pilot' could ever pull through in an impossible Airplane-style situation like that. That is all. Would I give them a license? Nope. Why? As mentioned, there's a lot more to it than being able to fly. There's the knowledge of the FARs, the AIM, fundamentals of flight, ATC basics, and so on, before even getting your private.Again, my point was that I'd argue some in the sim 'pilot' group could pull it off. I didn't say they'd pull it off well, or that we should just instantly certify sim 'pilots' with thousands of sim hours.Any sim pilot who wants to prove his/her stuff, even in as small of a plane as a Cessna is welcome to meet me at JYO for a run at it. I have 100% faith that you can pull it off, but I can nearly guarantee it won't be as good as someone who's flown outside the sim before.There's a difference between being able to do it, and being able to do it safely, and that's generally made up in the difference of experience and impassioned study.

i accept what your saying but again, why wont it be a safe landing? BTW i am talking about a situation when you've got a nother co-pilot like you.

[quadraspleen 7]

Paro (capital of Bhutan) is pretty fun.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlKApjc9T2U&feature=player_embeddedNo Kidding! Eeek! I bet his winglets were feet away from that house on the hill

[Daniel choen 23]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJoXMcehrYo

that pilots really pulled the trigger. Edited January 13, 2012 by Daniel choen

[scandinavian13 5,192]

i accept what your saying but again, why wont it be a safe landing? BTW i am talking about a situation when you've got a nother co-pilot like you.

I didn't specifically say the landing wouldn't be safe. Again, I would argue some people can pull it off, but what happens if an engine fails (both pilots are already out, so Murphy is clearly around somewhere), or the radios fail, or something else goes wrong? What if the weather is terrible, with bad gusts? Some could still pull it off, but if they're not as up to speed on the regs/rules/procedures/skills of the average flight crew in the aircraft, it's not going to be as safe. They don't have the skillset required yet to make it as safe as the pilots who do. That's my point, in general.

[Daniel choen 23]

I didn't specifically say the landing wouldn't be safe. Again, I would argue some people can pull it off, but what happens if an engine fails (both pilots are already out, so Murphy is clearly around somewhere), or the radios fail, or something else goes wrong? What if the weather is terrible, with bad gusts? Some could still pull it off, but if they're not as up to speed on the regs/rules/procedures/skills of the average flight crew in the aircraft, it's not going to be as safe. They don't have the skillset required yet to make it as safe as the pilots who do. That's my point, in general.

no problem have a good one, cheers mate. BTW don't forget to see the video. Edited January 13, 2012 by Daniel choen

[Michael Jastrzebski 0]

i am 16 and flew in a cessna the pilot gave me the controls for about 15 minutes,

Ok, now is clear where all your nonsense is coming from.You have a long way to learn about flying... Edited January 13, 2012 by Michael Jastrzebski

[atrdriver 7]

You do not need to be in the mountains or in IMC conditions to have a very difficult approach. For example take Lagoon Visual Rwy 8 at TJSJ (San Juan). There was nothing more difficult that I ever tried in FSX. The idea is that you follow localizer to Rwy 10 and in the last moment you do side-step to Rwy 8. An absolute perfect coordination is required in the last seconds or you won't make it. Try it.

I have shot this approach for real many times as an ATR captain when I was based in KSJU. Being told to expect that approach always put a smile on my face! It was challenging and required a constant turn all the way down to crossing the runway threshold. LOTS of fun!Someone mentioned the VOR/DME approach to 13L/R at KJFK. I've done that one REAL LIFE several times as well. I actually have a video of a first officer I flew with a few months ago shooting that approach to 13L. The video isn't great because the camcorder was mounted on a mount suction-cupped to the side window. I couldn't be distracted by trying to free-hand record.I have also done the Rosslyn LDA approach to Rwy 19 at KDCA a couple of times. The last time was about three weeks ago, at night with the ceiling at 1200ft. It was quite challenging and my first time doing it as a jet captain (EMB-145).The most exciting approach I ever did in real life was the visual approach to Rwy 09 at TDPD (Melville Hall, Dominica). You enter the left downwind leg over the water at 2500ft. By the time you turn base, you are 200ft above the ground! The terrain rises from sea level to (I believe) around 5000ft within a few miles! There's a saddleback along the north face of a ravine the runs all the way back down to the airport. You have to get into that ravine to make the runway! I have a great video that a first officer shot of me flying that approach in 1999. Don't ask me to post it because, as much as I would like to, I can't.I use FSX to prep for my sim training events at work. I did my first recurrent training in the EMB-145 on December 27th, 2011. The training was basically a KRNO (Reno, NV) checkout. We have some very elaborate company-designed engine failure procedures for that airport due to high terrain surrounding the airfield. I practiced those procedures extensively using the FeelThere EMB-145 in FSX (Ultimate Terrain installed). That add-on is good enough to allow me to practice company profiles in preparation for training/checking events. I can tell you that having practiced those procedures at home on FSX made the actual EMB sim at work (which is a multi-million dollar full motion sim) seem easy. I was fully familiar with everything I was required to do for the training event.Obviously, my favorite add-on is the PMDG 737NGX. I need to go try some of these approaches using that add-on. especially with the HUD! By the way, I have sat in the 737NG jumpseat on many occasions. The last time I did so, I peeked over the captain's shoulder through the HUD. All I can say is that the PMDG recreation of that HUD is SPOT ON!!!Keep the blue side up!Terry Edited January 13, 2012 by atrdriver