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Big improvement with replacement clouds


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50 replies to this topic

#1 Muskoka

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 03:10 PM

Guys, I just tried out these replacement clouds http://maxx-xp.hikin...om/?page_id=147 and my frame rates have jumped from a low of 7-8 when almost in or around the default clouds, to a low of 18 in the same conditions with these replacements. If I was just "near" the clouds with the default, my fps would be in the mid teens, with these they stayed high 20's to low 30's. Not only that, they look just as good to me. I also downloaded the replacement sky, and I like the look, a little more blue. It better matches what I see out the window today.Just make sure to back up you originals first. The install is real easy, replace a few texture files, that's it. These replacements have allowed me to fly with real weather again, and what I would consider to be very high settings. Haven't tried with HDR on yet, next thing to try. A few screen shots....Glen[attachment=39028:clouds1 (Medium).jpg][attachment=39029:cloud2 (Medium).jpg]

Edited by Muskoka, 20 February 2012 - 03:11 PM.


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#2 Comanche

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 03:38 PM

Looks promising! Ill give them a try later.Thanks for pointing these out.Rob

#3 fly_like_an_eagle

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 03:38 PM

that sounds promising. I was already giving up on XPX again after experiencing as low as 5 fps in clouds with 40% setting on a 4 GHz 6core i7. still worries me that the XPX developer can not come up with a product that provides acceptable fps out of the box. going from 40 with NO down to 4 fps WITH clouds doesn't sound like efficient programming to me. using 6 cores at 4 GHz and the latest directx11, NVidia Gforce 470 accelerator and all I got is lousy 4-5 fps. not impressed. I will give this a try, thanks for sharing.

#4 Muskoka

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 03:59 PM

After looking at the texture files it appears they have just been reduced in size, cloud_puff0, 1, and 2 have been reduced from 1024 down to 512. Could probably just do that with the defaults. Anyways, the reduction works, that's all that matters at this point, and they still look nice. Might even try them at 256, that might be pushing it a little low though.Posted ImageGlen

#5 fly_like_an_eagle

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 04:21 PM

what I find disturbing is the fact that when you are in clouds and see the least scenery, fps drop most. with clever programming this should not have to be the case, only when in solid fog or zero visibility clouds do fps rise again. the software should detect that once in clouds those other "TONS of - melting your cpu" cloud puffs hidden by the front row could be discarded, thus saving fps. not?

#6 rojantrojan

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 04:46 PM

using 6 cores at 4 GHz and the latest directx11,

Didn't really understand why X-plane 10 system requirements asks for: "a DirectX 10-capable (DX11 preferred) video card with 1 GB of on-board, dedicated VRAM."http://www.x-plane.c...m-requirements/I thought it was programmed in OpenGL? CheersRhydian

#7 alpilotx

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 04:56 PM

Didn't really understand why X-plane 10 system requirements asks for:

Because thats what most cards are marketed with, and what users - and humble salesperson - can more easily "understand". And the text says it: "capable". For the devs, this ensures, that if people buy a card with DX capabilities of this evel, then the card can do that in OpenGL too.

#8 deetee

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 04:59 PM

I was just starting to warm to the demo when I tried real weather, and BOOM!... fps dropped like a brick. :(It almost feels like 2006 all over again (FSX launch)!Roads too kill my fps when above default.What's incredible is it's doing that on an i7@4Ghz with a GTX580 and 12Gb ram.This is a beta though so let's hope LR have a few tricks up their sleeve before they arrive at a RC version.Now if I could find a nice plane where the knobs worked with the mouse wheel like in FS I would be a little happier. :-/

#9 alpilotx

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:02 PM

what I find disturbing is the fact that when you are in clouds and see the least scenery, fps drop most. with clever programming this should not have to be the case, only when in solid fog or zero visibility clouds do fps rise again. the software should detect that once in clouds those other "TONS of - melting your cpu" cloud puffs hidden by the front row could be discarded, thus saving fps. not?

What I never understand is, why so many people think, that they are smarter than hardcore 3D developers working in the industry for many years and coding with this kind of technology since many generations of the simulator. Believe me: even though they are no gods, and are prone to errors / suboptimal decisions ... they still have a very good understanding of what is possible with 3D technology, and what might be the best approach in a given situation with goals set by the concept of their simulator (even if there are always obstacles, to achieve all that they want) ...And don't forget, programming 3D engines (and a simulator in general) means much more than what meets the eye ...

#10 N1G

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:20 PM

I hope this cloud issue is not a coding problem which has pushed the devs into a corner. In other words, is it a bad coding design, which at this stage the dev team might be looking at each other saying "uh oh".If true, it would sound quite a bit like FSX in certain aspects.Bob

Edited by N1G, 20 February 2012 - 05:22 PM.


#11 HiFlyer

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:43 PM

When we discuss these problems with the clouds, do we mean in HDR, or in normal mode?

#12 Muskoka

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:56 PM

Normal mode for me, HDR is just too much of a performance hit. I have to turn too many things way down to use HDR. If my video card even sees a cloud it turns and runs. These replacements do help. You could just reduce the default cloud textures and get the same results. The author has tweaked these a bit I think, other than just a reduction in size.Glen

Edited by Muskoka, 20 February 2012 - 07:18 PM.


#13 HiFlyer

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 06:06 PM

I suspect people will have to post their settings and what version of the beta they are using before any Xplane forum gurus will be able to offer help with possible cloud problems. The reduced texture clouds sound interesting, though.

#14 fly_like_an_eagle

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 06:16 PM

"What I never understand is, why so many people think, that they are smarter than hardcore 3D developers working in the industry for many years and coding with this kind of technology since many generations of the simulator."coding for many years alone does not automatically guarantee expertise in all graphics engine subjects. or take the flawed flight model. but all these "so many people" can still compare XPX with other products. just take a look at the Unigine demo to see what is possible on todays graphics hardware, you don't have to be a "hardcore 3D developer working in the industry for many years" to appreciate the superiority of the latest NVidia and ATI graphics demos:http://www.nvidia.com/object/cool_stuff.htmlhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMgofmIQElEhttp://unigine.com/products/heaven/

#15 N1G

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 06:19 PM

Has there been any noise from the developers on this? It does not seem that this cloud issue is just affecting a specific hardware config, but is widespread. I don't know, I just think there should be some customer service to some degree.I don't own it, but I am keeping my eye on some of the threads.Bob

#16 rojantrojan

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 06:38 PM

Because thats what most cards are marketed with, and what users - and humble salesperson - can more easily "understand". And the text says it: "capable". For the devs, this ensures, that if people buy a card with DX capabilities of this evel, then the card can do that in OpenGL too.

Ahhh I see, thanks for clarifying Andras. Makes sense.Cheers Rhydian

#17 Longranger

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 07:08 PM

that sounds promising. I was already giving up on XPX again after experiencing as low as 5 fps in clouds with 40% setting on a 4 GHz 6core i7. still worries me that the XPX developer can not come up with a product that provides acceptable fps out of the box

40% ? With 10.04 beta 4 ?Why? I must say in the current version 15% looks (IMHO) much more realistic and gives a much better performance.

#18 Jean-Jacques

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 07:20 PM

Folks, update your versions of XPX! Something's been tweaked in the 'clouds' department!Like Bob just said, I don't own it (yet), but I'm reading as much as I can in the meantime.JJ

#19 Muskoka

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 07:24 PM

40% ? With 10.04 beta 4 ?Why? I must say in the current version 15% looks (IMHO) much more realistic and gives a much better performance.

40% would be impossible for me. I usually run clouds at 10% so I can use more objects. The screen shots I posted have clouds at 10%.Glen

#20 GoranM

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 08:00 PM

40% clouds with a GTX 470????Asking a bit much from your graphics card, aren't ya, "eagle"?

#21 Simmo W

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 08:23 PM

I posted my latest settings here, getting very pleasing results:http://xplane10.wordpress.com/2012/02/19/xpx-10-04-beta-4-settings-and-fps/At 21% the clouds still look cool and inside them it's much more transparent, and I'm seeing about 15fps inside them.Alas I have had to switch off hdr during the day, but I hardly miss it, ESP as the effects are more obvious at night where it's easier on fps.I'm finding that you have to revisit your settings after every update, just in case some new improvement can be taken advantage of. Doesn't take long to revisit.

#22 HiFlyer

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 08:53 PM

Being insane, I immediately tried to see what it looked like with clouds at 100%I estimate frames at about 5Fps (graphics card still not interested at all in the proceedings) but interestingly enough, while the clouds were very definitely more detailed, I actually found them slightly less realistic than at lower levels. Some of the larger cloud layers looked like they were made of zillions of tiny little balls of a hundred almost imperceptibly different shades cleverly pretending to be a cloud. :blink:I would say that sometimes there can definitely be too much of a good thing.Edit: I remember what it reminded me of. A pointillist painting.

Edited by HiFlyer', 20 February 2012 - 08:56 PM.


#23 deetee

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 12:48 AM

I suspect people will have to post their settings and what version of the beta they are using before any Xplane forum gurus will be able to offer help with possible cloud problems. The reduced texture clouds sound interesting, though.

Latest beta (10.04 beta 4) with HDR and clouds at 40%.If one can't enjoy a stutter-free experience with a turbo-nutter graphics card at just 40 % then LR might want to rethink that slider. ;)It's important to set expectations even with the best of today's hardware.

#24 GoranM

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 01:38 AM

Latest beta (10.04 beta 4) with HDR and clouds at 40%.If one can't enjoy a stutter-free experience with a turbo-nutter graphics card at just 40 % then LR might want to rethink that slider. ;)It's important to set expectations even with the best of today's hardware.

The GTX 470 is a "turbo nutter" graphics card???The 560 (pretty much considered the standard today) beats it in every test.

#25 deetee

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 02:14 AM

The GTX 470 is a "turbo nutter" graphics card???The 560 (pretty much considered the standard today) beats it in every test.

Hi there, you're quite correct but I don't believe I said I had a GTX470; I am running a GTX580.David