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MSF Repaint Help and Tips

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Hi,

 

Prior to attempting any Flight repaints I've been using Paint.net and several tutorials designed for FS9 and X. All has been going well except I haven't been able to add an alpha layer to a DDS file using Paint.net alone. As a workaround I saved the file without the alpha layer and then added it in DXTBmp. This is my first experience with any repainting.

 

Jim F.

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@ Luis and for Everyone... Wow...that was a lot! :Shocked:  

 

Yes... I am hanging my head in shame... I did pick the biggest plane out of the bunch to start... but I am learnin'...lol and yes you are right Luis I have never used Photoshop either.... How'd ya know??? lol

 

I will do my best to try and explain how you can NOT get the dreaded GimpforAVSIM125_zpsf05c6d2f.jpg checker board thingy...lol

 

First... follow along the Addon Tutorial "Add a New Livery at: http://flighttoolkit.com/?page_id=15

 

1. After you have created an Addon Settings file to which ever you want to name it click "Add Item"

 

GimpforAVSIM15_zps60865850.jpg

 

2. Click Next

 

GimpforAVSIM25_zpsde103b0c.jpg

 

3. For this example I am choosing the "Icon A5"

 

GimpforAVSIM35_zps7a5f7bb5.jpg

 

4. For this example I am now choosing "Slate"

 

GimpforAVSIM45_zps544edd6a.jpg

 

5. Keep everything checked that is already checked (I believe)

 

GimpforAVSIM5_zps06300481.jpg

 

6. In the "Output Texture Format" There is two choices, "Original" & "PSD"....Choose "PSD" if you choose "Original" you will get the grey checkerboard thingy again.

 

GimpforAVSIM75_zps7965f932.jpg

 

7. Now Enter the name of the Livery you want.

 

GimpforAVSIM8_zps4bef630c.jpg

 

8. Now click "Finish".

 

GimpforAVSIM9_zps49df7591.jpg

 

9. So now... when you open your Addon File.. it should look like this:

 

GimpforAVSIM12_zps23961a54.jpg

 

and not this...

 

GimpforAVSIM125_zpsf05c6d2f.jpg

 

I believe that is what you are talking about Luis...right???

 

And by the way Luis... I please want your Shark P-51 :p0503:

Thanks,

-fryer



Any idea when the Shark P-51 will be available Luis???  :im Not Worthy:  Big%20Grin.gif

 

Tanks,

 

-fryer

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B)  Thanks very much for your kind words about my Fuerza Aérea Dominicana Mustang repaints - I worked hard on them and it took me a few weeks to finish, so I appreciate your very kind comments. I must say, though, that I made many beginner mistakes. In particular, I gave it too much reflection, too many highlights. The whole thing is very shiny. While this does make a big impression, it is probably an error. But, I like it like that! :lol:

 

Let's see if we can look at this DDS/PSD issue more closely. The question is not how to edit the RGB channels on the texture, but how to modify the alpha channel (the grayscale part of the image that controls the amount of reflection.)

 

If we load a dds file into the GIMP (with the appropriate dds plug-in installed), this is what we get:

 

dds_edit_01_zpsfd60a61e.jpg

 

 

 

The alpha channel is displayed as a checker pattern over the RGB channels and there is really no way to modify it.

 

And if we load a Photoshop-format file (psd), here is the result:

 

dds_edit_02_zps46e4099a.jpg

 

 

 

The RGB channels display correctly and can easily be edited. But, please notice that we are showing the Layers, not the Channels on the Navigation Dialogue on the right-hand side.

 

If we select the Channels instead, we get this:

 

dds_edit_03_zpsa705bd71.jpg

 

 

 

The RGB channels are turned on (they are visible) whereas the alpha channel is hidden and is labeled "Extra" channel. Normally, the alpha channel is labeled as such and is up with the RGB channels, while here it is a separate channel.

 

O.K., if we try hiding the RGB channels and displaying the "Extra" channel, we get this:

 

dds_edit_04_zps46a1efae.jpg

 

 

 

Instead of a grayscale image, we have a red channel. I tried modifying this as if it were a normal alpha channel, i.e., lighter for more reflection and darker for less, but I think it worked backwards! :rolleyes:  And I also tried reducing it from RGB to Grayscale, but this affected all the channels and removed the color from the RGB.

 

So, I do not know of a way to edit the alpha channel without using Martin Wright's DXTBmp.

 

 

 

Layers

 

A word about Layers, Fryer, since I notice you are painting directly on the texture.

 

There is nothing wrong with that, and you can do it if you like. But, Layers are very helpful and you may want to learn to use them.

 

An image can have multiple layers. As was pointed out, I have 58 layers on the texture that is shown above. Each Layer has a different element in the livery - one layer has the blue mouth, another has the white teeth, another the eye. Or one layer has the fuselage, another the numbers, another has the rivets and panel lines that display above the numbers.

 

There are great advantages to working this way. If you have to go back and redo an element, it will be isolated on its own Layer, you won't have to worry about affecting the rest of the paint job, you don't have to painstakingly select it again. Just modify it at will and very easily.

 

The native formats for both Photoshop and the GIMP (psd and xcf) will save the image with all the layers intact, so that you can always come back and find all your elements separate.

 

However, when it comes time to Export your image, you will first have to Flatten all the Layers, that is, to reduce the image to only one Layer. You can do this by right-click on any Layer in the right-hand side dialogue, and select Flatten at the bottom of the list that pops up.

 

So, you should Save your work separately with Layers intact, and then Flatten the image and Export it for use in the Addon Builder.

 

Best regards.

Luis

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@@LuisFelizTirado To turn the red off in the alpha channel, turn the layer off and go back to the alpha channel.With the extra channel visible and all layers off, you get a gray-scale image.

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@ Luis  You are most welcome on the comments.  You are doing an awesome job, regardless of the "so-called" "mistakes".  We love the fact that we can "learn from "yours"...lol

 

 

Let's see if we can look at this DDS/PSD issue more closely. The question is not how to edit the RGB channels on the texture, but how to modify the alpha channel (the grayscale part of the image that controls the amount of reflection.)

 

If we load a dds file into the GIMP (with the appropriate dds plug-in installed), this is what we get:

 

The alpha channel is displayed as a checker pattern over the RGB channels and there is really no way to modify it. This was no joke…This is exactly what I was up against using Gimp 2.8 for the first time… thought I was doing something wrong.  Which I was…’cause I couldn’t edit nothing.

 

And if we load a Photoshop-format file (psd), here is the result: Z  Is this what you mean (what I am saying) at that critical moment when adding a new livery for the first time in Flight Tools Addon…instead of ‘Original’ (i.e. .dds file) format ‘Choose PSD’ (.psd)

 

 

The RGB channels display correctly and can easily be edited. But, please notice that we are showing the Layers, not the Channels on the Navigation Dialogue on the right-hand side.

If we select the Channels instead, we get this:

 

The RGB channels are turned on (they are visible) whereas the alpha channel is hidden and is labeled "Extra" channel. Normally, the alpha channel is labeled as such and is up with the RGB channels, while here it is a separate channel.

 

O.K., if we try hiding the RGB channels and displaying the "Extra" channel, we get this:

 

Instead of a grayscale image, we have a red channel. I tried modifying this as if it were a normal alpha channel, i.e., lighter for more reflection and darker for less, but I think it worked backwards!

And I also tried reducing it from RGB to Grayscale, but this affected all the channels and removed the color from the RGB.

 

So, I do not know of a way to edit the alpha channel without using Martin Wright's DXTBmp.  For the last 3 paragraphs…is this a potential problem for me/us since we are using Gimp for the first time?  Do we need to get this "Martin Wright's DXTBmp?"

 

Layers

 

A word about Layers, Fryer, since I notice you are painting directly on the texture. Hey…how did you know?...lol

 

There is nothing wrong with that, and you can do it if you like. (Do I get a better “end result if I do it this way?  However, I want to work smarter-er and not harder-er…lol)  But, Layers are very helpful and you may want to learn to use them.  ZIs this the working smarter-er part???

 

An image can have multiple layers. As was pointed out, I have 58 layers on the texture that is shown above. Each Layer has a different element in the livery - one layer has the blue mouth, another has the white teeth, another the eye. Or one layer has the fuselage, another the numbers, another has the rivets and panel lines that display above the numbers.

 

There are great advantages to working this way. If you have to go back and redo an element, it will be isolated on its own Layer, which is very cool by the way…lol  you won't have to worry about affecting the rest of the paint job, you don't have to painstakingly select it again. Just modify it at will and very easily.

 

Ok…question here…when you say you have 58 layers…I understand the concept of “the mouth has one layer”, “another has the rivets and panel lines that display above the numbers.”

  1. ”How” do you incorporate that from what I am doing painting directly onto the texture?
  2. I am guessing that you have to do this “from the beginning?”

The native formats for both Photoshop and the GIMP (psd Z as opposed to “Original” mode (i.e. .xcf ??), right? and xcf) will save the image with all the layers intact, so that you can always come back and find all your elements separate.  ZOkay… I need to learn that part right there.  What do I/we do?  Step by step… we are newbies…lol

 

However, when it comes time to Export your image, you will first have to Flatten all the Layers, that is, to reduce the image to only one Layer. You can do this by right-click on any Layer in the right-hand side dialogue, and select Flatten at the bottom of the list that pops up.  Okay… so if you have 58 layers or whatever… do you have to do this to “each layer?”

 

So, you should Save your work separately with Layers intact,  Okay..how do I/we do that??  Step by step…lol and then Flatten the image Z Step by step…lol and Export it for use in the Addon Builder.  Export from Gimp 2.8 to the Flight Tools folder that has your livery that you want?  Step by step would be most beneficial…lol

 

Whew!  I’m done asking for now…lol   80P  Thank you soooo much for your hard work Luis on this... it took me 30-45 minutes to figure out my questions and what I wanted to say...lol  so I can imagine what it is like for you.

 

Tanks

-fryer   :p0503: 

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Luis, theoretically you shouldn't need to flatten an image and save it for the Addon Builder to be able to load it as long as you don't have any vector layers, and even then, maybe it works?  I can't remember if I tested this or not.

 

Is there only one DDS plugin for GIMP?  It is terrible if it is loading DDS files with the alpha channel baked into the RGB like that.  Maybe there is a better one?

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I think there are 2 plugins that I know of, 1 for 32bit gimp and 1 for 64bit gimp. I haven't used the dds format lately in gimp 2.8, but I might try it and see if it does that with the alpha channel for me.

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Luis, theoretically you shouldn't need to flatten an image and save it for the Addon Builder to be able to load it as long as you don't have any vector layers, and even then, maybe it works?  I can't remember if I tested this or not.

 

Is there only one DDS plugin for GIMP?  It is terrible if it is loading DDS files with the alpha channel baked into the RGB like that.  Maybe there is a better one?

 

I thought about this question about saving with or without layers, and it seemed to me that saving with layers might make the file larger.

 

So yes, I flatten the image before saving. (I am using Photoshop)


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I thought about this question about saving with or without layers, and it seemed to me that saving with layers might make the file larger.

 

So yes, I flatten the image before saving. (I am using Photoshop)

 

If you're saving layered image into file format that doesn't support layers, you really don't have to flatten anything.

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D

 

If you're saving layered image into file format that doesn't support layers, you really don't have to flatten anything.

Don't both DDS and Photoshop PSD support layers, though?

 

God knows what Flight uses internally, though.....


We are all connected..... To each other, biologically...... To the Earth, chemically...... To the rest of the Universe atomically.
 
Devons rig
Intel Core i5 13600K @ 5.1GHz / G.SKILL Trident Z5 RGB Series Ram 32GB / GIGABYTE GeForce RTX 4070 Ti GAMING OC 12G Graphics Card / Sound Blaster Z / Meta Quest 2 VR Headset / Klipsch® Promedia 2.1 Computer Speakers / ASUS ROG SWIFT PG279Q ‑ 27" IPS LED Monitor ‑ QHD / 1x Samsung SSD 850 EVO 500GB / 2x Samsung SSD 860 EVO 1TB /  1x Samsung - 970 EVO Plus 2TB NVMe /  1x Samsung 980 NVMe 1TB / 2 other regular hd's with up to 10 terabyte capacity / Windows 11 Pro 64-bit / Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite AX Motherboard LGA 1700 DDR5

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Flight uses DDS in the .pak files, but It compresses everything to save space.

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Don't both DDS and Photoshop PSD support layers, though?

 

DDS definitely doesn't support layers. PSD is just Photoshop specific format used for editing and doesn't mean to be used for end-user viewing or (in this case) game textures.

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Guys, Steve was very thorough with the Addon Builder - it will export a PSD (Photoshop) file that can be loaded in the GIMP, and he just mentioned that there is no need to flatten the file after repainting it.

 

So, the Addon Builder should support a layered image file in PSD format, and it will also create the MIP Maps for the DDS file when creating the addon.

 

Best regards.

Luis

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