If I could upgrade 1 or 2 things on my system...

[IFR7700 228]

"Magic" for me didn't start happening till around 4.3 GHz on my 3770K.  With DX10, things just started working without stutters, etc.  I'm now at a very stable 4.7 GHz with Corsair H100 watercooling.  My sim has never been close to being better.  Solid 30 FPS locked with the NGX, etc.

 

I would strongly reconsider overclocking with water cooling, because you just aren't going to get much more than 4.0 GHz with air.  Also, it is my understanding that delidding a 3770 or 4770K can make a substantial difference for you.  It seems like you want to get to the higher end computer for your FS9/FSX, so this would be the way to go.

 

As far as motherboards go, you had the high end (at the time) with the Rampage II, so I would look at a similar quality MB for the Z87.

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=-1&IsNodeId=1&Description=z87%20motherboard&bop=And&Order=REVIEWS&PageSize=20

 

Good Luck

[ant_1984 20]

I would strongly reconsider overclocking with water cooling, because you just aren't going to get much more than 4.0 GHz with air

 

I have a different opinion here. Up to 4.5Ghz or potentially slightly higher should be quite doable on "high end" air, but I do agree that for the most part water cooling will be better. Ofcourse it will also come down to how much voltage your chip is going to need to push those speeds etc.

 

Depending on which AIO water cooler you choose, Air may even be better.

 

I had better results on a previous build I'd done for someone using a Hyper 212 Evo vs a Corsair H60 2013 edition using a 2600K clocked at 4.5Ghz.

[IFR7700 228]

 

I have a different opinion here. Up to 4.5Ghz or potentially slightly higher should be quite doable on "high end" air, but I do agree that for the most part water cooling will be better. Ofcourse it will also come down to how much voltage your chip is going to need to push those speeds etc.

 

Depending on which AIO water cooler you choose, Air may even be better.

 

I had better results on a previous build I'd done for someone using a Hyper 212 Evo vs a Corsair H60 2013 edition using a 2600K clocked at 4.5Ghz.

 

Interesting, indeed.  I had the Noctua D-14 and just automatically replaced it when I started OC'ing over 4.0.  Anyhow, I'm sure it wouldn't work with 4.7.  To the OP, try the aircooling ... they're not that expensive.  If you like your sim at the max speed you can get with air ... keep it.

[Dave_YVR 968]

 Getting a 3770K to 4.7 period is a lucky CPU, as they say only 20% of them will be able to get there regardless of how it's cooled.

 

  Depending on your climate and the temps in the room, a good air cooler will go pretty much toe to toe (within a couple degrees) with a closed loop liquid setup for everyday use. I also found that the Corsair closed loop systems can also be rather loud compared to a Noctua setup.

 

 Either way the OP is talking about minimal or no overclock so a good air cooler will do just fine.

[CaptKornDog 281]

Not sure a Noctua NH-D14 would fit in my case but a Hyper 212 EVO may look very tempting. Maybe I could push my 975 up past 3.5 GHz (3.7 maybe?) with it in the interim until I decide on a CPU/MB solution in the next month or two.

 

On sale at Microcenter for $29, may mean a trip for me today.

[Appliance 51]

Kyle the practical difference between 3.5 and 3.7 is nothing in terms of frames and/or smoothness. You will feel better having made the trip, buying new hardware, fitting it etc. but for little real benefit ... benchmarks maybe but not sim. On the other hand with Haswell/Z87 you certainly notice the difference. Over to you.  :rolleyes:

[CaptKornDog 281]

Kyle the practical difference between 3.5 and 3.7 is nothing in terms of frames and/or smoothness. You will feel better having made the trip, buying new hardware, fitting it etc. but for little real benefit ... benchmarks maybe but not sim. On the other hand with Haswell/Z87 you certainly notice the difference. Over to you. :rolleyes:

Well, again, it's one upgrade I can make now that's compatible for my current system and upgrades. CPU/MB won't be happening for 2-3 months. So why not? Maybe I'll get even beyond that based on some of the results above and be surprised. Price is certainly right at $29.

[CaptKornDog 281]

To those who suggested the Hyper 212 Evo, thank you. My system is indeed running cooler and better yet is much quieter than my previous CPU fan. I hope to be able to use it on my next chip as well, which I think will indeed be the 4770K...I haven't heard many overwhelming opinions on anything outside of i5/i7 product lines. A local retailer has them in stock for $90 off the usual price. I will probably go with a marginal overclock like I have now since I'm still not too comfortable (and new) with it. MBs I'm still wrapping my head around, opinions on those go all over the place.

[CaptKornDog 281]

Hello all,

 

Well, I think I'm probably within about 2 weeks of making the jump with my upgrade.  I'm pretty set on an i7 4770k with a conservative, middle of the road OC on air using the Hyper 212 Evo from my above post.  Not to mention it's $90 off at a local retailer.  One thing I can't decide on is a motherboard.  I currently use an Asus setup and have been pretty happy with it, so I've steered my search toward possibly a Maximus Gene, Maximus Hero, or Z87-A.  Any chance anyone had any experiences (good or bad) that they may be willing to share?  There are almost too many choices out there and MBs certainly aren't my most knowledgeable area at the moment.

 

Thanks!

[Adam T Lutley 12]

"Magic" for me didn't start happening till around 4.3 GHz on my 3770K.  With DX10, things just started working without stutters, etc.  I'm now at a very stable 4.7 GHz with Corsair H100 watercooling.  My sim has never been close to being better.  Solid 30 FPS locked with the NGX, etc.

 

I would strongly reconsider overclocking with water cooling, because you just aren't going to get much more than 4.0 GHz with air.  Also, it is my understanding that delidding a 3770 or 4770K can make a substantial difference for you.  It seems like you want to get to the higher end computer for your FS9/FSX, so this would be the way to go.

 

As far as motherboards go, you had the high end (at the time) with the Rampage II, so I would look at a similar quality MB for the Z87.

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=-1&IsNodeId=1&Description=z87%20motherboard&bop=And&Order=REVIEWS&PageSize=20

 

Good Luck

I agree with above sentiment. My latest FSX dedicated PC build centered around a 3770K OC'd @ 4.5 Ghz and set up and tuned per NickN's bible finally got me as close as I've ever come to being satisfied with FSX performance. I'm able to stay above 20 FPS in almost every scenario at high graphics settings.I'm talking ORBX, FlyTampa, Aerosoft, Taxi2Gate scenery, + PMDG aircraft + REX generated clouds and weather. The rest of my specs are posted. Can finally pan around the cockpit in my NGX at a busy airport without stutters. I may have gotten lucky on my CPU but I was able to achieve my overclock with a $30 CM Hyper 212 EVO with two fans in a push pull arrangement. 4.5 Ghz seems to be the most common overclock ceiling for the Ivy Bridge and Hazwells without de-lidding. That's regardless of weather employing water or air cooling. Budget closed loop water coolers like the Corsair H60/H80 series are on par with good air coolers. Additionally, CPU temps during sim sessions should come nowhere near temps seen during bench marking. If able to stay below 80c while testing your overclock with Prime95, 3Dmark11 software etc, you should be fine. Regards and good luck

[CaptKornDog 281]

Think I've settled on the Maximus VI Hero for the mobo finally. Has anyone had any direct experiences with it?

 

Looks like this weekend I'll be purchasing this, some new RAM, and the 4770k (packaged together should be able to save about $130 off retail).

[Guest]

Make sure that RAM is 2400Mhz CL9

[martin-w 3,234]

 I'm now at a very stable 4.7 GHz with Corsair H100 watercooling. 

 

I would strongly reconsider overclocking with water cooling, because you just aren't going to get much more than 4.0 GHz with air. 

 

 

 

Interesting, indeed.  I had the Noctua D-14 and just automatically replaced it when I started OC'ing over 4.0.  Anyhow, I'm sure it wouldn't work with 4.7.  To the OP, try the aircooling ... they're not that expensive.  If you like your sim at the max speed you can get with air ... keep it.

 

You have an H100 right?

 

Then most definitely your old D14 would have handled the overclock.

 

The D14 outperforms the H100 by a long way. The D14 outperforms the H100i as well.

 

It's only really the H110 [and one or two others] that out preform the D14 and the other handful of top notch air coolers. Plus the Kraken of course, but then NZXT cheat by including high RPM noisy fans.

 

If you compare coolers with the same fans installed, the H110 is king.

 

Some seem to think that just because it's water it has to be better than air. Nothing could be further from the truth. Water as the transfer medium can't fix a limited surface area, less than stellar pump, limited tube diameter, and less than efficient fans.

 

When you get those things right too, as in a full blown custom loop, or the H110 with sizable radiator, you're in business with water.

 

 

 Budget closed loop water coolers like the Corsair H60/H80 series are on par with good air coolers.

 

That depends how you define "good" because they certainly aren't on a par with "the best" air coolers.

[Adam T Lutley 12]

 

 

That depends how you define "good" because they certainly aren't on a par with "the best" air coolers.

 

My basic point was to dispel the myth about water coolers regarding cooling performance compared to aftermarket heat sinks. The Noctua might well outperform the budget closed loop water coolers. My $30 CM 212 EVO is very close in performance to the Corsair h60/h80 series coolers. The basic myth is this: Water coolers are always superior to air cooling. I've heard this countless times. However, higher end water coolers like the Corsair 110 series or well-designed custom water coolers are superior to almost any form of air cooling. The mistake most people make is to employ water cooling for a moderate overclock when they could have much more easily and cheaply opted for a quality aftermarket heat sink and a couple of fans. If wanting to push your I7 2600 past 5 ghz, a high quality water cooler might be your only option. The vast majority of novice overclockers  will not (and should not) push the envelope with their cpu. I agree with you completely on your post. Regards

 You shouldn't need to use liquid cooling (talking self contained) if you don't want to. A good quality air unit should overclock just fine. Some of the best overclocks on my 2500K were on air with a Cooler Master Hyper 212 and it ran great, as cool if not better than my current H80 with better fans.  Either way, I'd NEVER use the stock fan/heatsink.

Perfectly summed up!

 

I have a different opinion here. Up to 4.5Ghz or potentially slightly higher should be quite doable on "high end" air, but I do agree that for the most part water cooling will be better. Ofcourse it will also come down to how much voltage your chip is going to need to push those speeds etc.

 

Depending on which AIO water cooler you choose, Air may even be better.

 

I had better results on a previous build I'd done for someone using a Hyper 212 Evo vs a Corsair H60 2013 edition using a 2600K clocked at 4.5Ghz.

My 3770k @ 4.5 Ghz is cooled by a $30 CM Hyper 212 EVO with two fans in a push-pull arrangement. Below 80C during stress testing and around 45-55c during sim sessions. I'm sure I got lucky with my CPU though. Regards

[martin-w 3,234]

 The Noctua might well outperform the budget closed loop water coolers.

 

 

It does better than that. It outperforms the H100i, which isn't a budget cooler.

 

 

The basic myth is this: Water coolers are always superior to air cooling. I've heard this countless times.

 

 

 

Yep, agree with you. As I said above, water as a heat transfer medium doesn't render a cooler an air beater if the diameter of the tubing is limited, the rad surface area is limited and the pump is limited. And actually, the above applies to many of the AIO coolers out there, apart from a few of the very best.

 

 

However, higher end water coolers like the Corsair 110 series or well-designed custom water coolers are superior to almost any form of air cooling.

 

 

True, and there aren't that many, not when you eliminate the fan variable.  H110 yes. Kraken yes, but only by a few degrees, if you wind the fans down to a reasonable level. Swiftech H220.

 

Air cooling is still holding it's own against the AIO coolers, in terms of reasonable 24/7 overclocks. The best AIO cooler [eliminating the fan variable] is the H110, and it beats the D14 by 5 degrees. And 5 degrees higher, for most of us, overclocking to a sensible 24/7 frequency, with a sensible temperature margin isn't going to limit us significantly. For those pushing to the limits it's obviously a different story though.

 

Having said the above, I do expect AIO coolers to gradually capture more and more of the enthusiast market. It's not just about cooling, aesthetically they look better, and more space inside the enclosure is handy. The manufacturers will have to do more to appease those of us concerned about leaks though.