My First Post: Joystick Versus Yoke

[TSquare 0]

Need some input: My Saitek X52 is dead. I have always used a joystick just a throw back to my old CFS2 days. So my question is this which is better for P3D a joystick throttle combo like a X52 PRO or a Yoke and throttle combo. I Fly CFS2, FS2004, and am just getting into P3D. So I am looking for suggestions or opinions 

[LAdamson 240]

I use the Saitek X52, and if it dies, I'll probably get another joystick.  I just don't have the room, to want to setup a yoke. And if it was a yoke, I'd want an expensive metal unit. I've flown plenty of real planes with yokes, and many with 

sticks. So it doesn't matter to me, as to which is the most realistic for the simulated airplane. 

[Artem Crum 5]

Consumer level joysticks technology is much more advanced and polished than for consumer level yokes. CH and Saitek yokes all have the same flaws - sticky shafts and little travel length in elevator axis, which makes them mostly unusable if you want to do a good flare on landing. Even far more expensive devices like those from PFC and GoFlight have about 70mm travel in elevator (same as Saitek and CH). May be they are not sticky though.

 

So, joystick is a better choice for the same money in most cases. 

 

And to be clear. Good joystick gives more realistic 'feel' than a bad yoke. Even if you fly 737 and moreover if you fly GA airplanes. 

[Qatsimo 7]

I owned a PFC once, should last a lifetime, lol.

It had a very sticky shaft. They send me a new spring once,

but on a second request for a new spring I never got reply.

Then the switches broke one after the other.

I think it was for 4 years, 1000 euro sim fun.

 

My Saitek yoke has a smooth shaft.

[ajpongress 467]

Went from sticks to yokes and back to sticks.

I had an X-52, and when that died I had the CH Yoke and pedals. All plastic and felt like Fisher Price. Pedals too close together. When the yoke clamps broke (cheap plastic), I went with the Saitek Yoke system with the throttle quad.

The throttle quad potentiometers got out of whack within a year and a half. Horrible spiking in the axis. The yoke developed a spiking in the center. Deadzone helped a little but not much.

I bought a second stand alone throttle quad to replace the other one, and the axis on that had bad spiking a year later.

 

I had enough and bought the Saitek X-55 HOTAS setup 2 months ago. Best stick I've ever had.

 

The problems with low end yokes like CH and Saitek is that they have a definite "center" that you can feel. Makes it hard to get precision movements when dealing with that "center detent". The tension on the Y axis is too stiff compared to the X axis.

The X-55 has different tension springs you can swap in and out. I get way more control with that stick, and the throttle has lots of switches and knobs on it.

I like the X-55 over the Warthog because all the switches are universal and not marked like the Warthog is, plus you get more of them.

 

I would say if you're building a dedicated sim pit, then you would want some nice yokes to go in there, about $1,000 ish. If you're just sitting at your desk, just save yourself the trouble and get a simple stick / throttle setup that is easy to bring out / put away when you want to fly.

[Guest Mik75]

I have both setups on my desk (Saitek PF yoke & TQ and a Logitech G940 force feedback joystick, together with the Saitek PF rudder pedals), and actually I like to fly yoke planes with the Saitek yoke and stick planes with the Logitech. But in terms of precision (flare on landing, precise rotation, etc.), the joystick works much better than the yoke. Plus, it's force feedback really adds something to the overall immersion and experience! So, I find myself using the joystick more often than the yoke. And I have to agree, the TQ of the Saitek set is really bad, I even have an additional TQ to have a total of 6 levers, and except for 2 flawlessly working axes, all others cause heavy spiking and are hardly usable to command precise settings! If I had to decide for just one control system, I'd go for a joystick!

[ryanbatc 12,799]

I've always had a stick.

 

But I wonder if a yoke would help me when flying online. Some aircraft, which are difficult to trim in the sim, would be better served by a yoke. This way my left hand could be on the yoke and I could use my right hand to continue to work the mouse etc.

 

This issue is especially apparent in XP10 where Acft are super twitchy. But for P3D I think either stick or yoke is just fine. Plus P3D /FSX has always had far better (bigger) clickspots than XP10.

[twojastara 85]

Few months ago, I have bought Saitek Cessna Yoke and I am very satisfied. I was expecting much lower quality for this price.

 

For me, flaring is much easier with yoke than with joystick. Finally, I can do it for A2A planes.

 

I am surprised, that in this thread, I am the only one for the yoke. Maybe the previous versions were worst in terms of quality?

[Guest Mik75]

I've always had a stick.

 

But I wonder if a yoke would help me when flying online. Some aircraft, which are difficult to trim in the sim, would be better served by a yoke. This way my left hand could be on the yoke and I could use my right hand to continue to work the mouse etc.

 

This issue is especially apparent in XP10 where Acft are super twitchy. But for P3D I think either stick or yoke is just fine. Plus P3D /FSX has always had far better (bigger) clickspots than XP10.

That's a good point. I have a Logitech G19 and I programmed its function keys to be used as a (sort of) MCP for changing speed, altitude, etc. That works quite nicely, at least in some planes.

In XPX that works perfectly and can be set up very easy! Also, for XPX, there is a neat App for iOS that allows you to tune radios on the phone, which is very handy when flying online!

[Wobbie 938]

I've been using CH-Products yoke & pedals for many years now. Never a problem! Maybe the pedals are a little too close, maybe the yoke does have a center position. BUT, the immersion factor is so much greater when flying. A joystick with a Cessna 175? With a Boeing? How crazy to even think that! A twist rudder?

 

Our kids, 60 of them, in our VA project, all use joysticks. As a 'reward'some of them fly our sims, & it is amazing to see how they get emmersed in controlling the plane. We also have an Avro Shackletion sim, with yokes.

 

Stick to Joysticks for fighters & Airbus's (& a few others) but for realism & emmersion, go for yokes, where applicable,

[carlito777 712]

 

 

Stick to Joysticks for fighters & Airbus's (& a few others) but for realism & emmersion, go for yokes, where applicable,

 

+1

I'm also using a Saitek yoke and TQ. It has its twitches but given the price the quality is ok. Before buying the yoke, I flew everything with my Saitek X52. My personal opinion is that the yoke adds A LOT of immersion when flying planes that have a yoke in the real world. I cannot imagine flying the NGX with a stick. Together with FSUIPC you can set your axis so that you get a very nice feel when flying with the yoke even though they have only little travel on the elevator axis...

[~Craig~ 10]

In my opinion, if you're flying aircraft in the sim that have a yoke, then a yoke is always going to be better that a joystick.    I believe even a lower cost (Saitek or CH Products) yoke is better than a high end joystick - if you're flying aircraft that have a yoke.

 

Whilst the build quality of the Saitek and CH Products yokes is not the best, I've owned both and both served me for years without any problems.   I owned a CH Products yoke for 6 years, and then moved to the Saitek Yoke when it was released (around 2010 I believe) and have never had problems with it.

 

The difference in 'axes length' between a joystick and a yoke is significant.  For example, full axes movement length of the Saitek Yoke on it's aileron axis is probably around 10cms.  (By this I mean that turning the yoke from full left, to full right axis, is a rotational 'length' of around 10cm.

 

Contrast that with a typical joystick left/right axis 'length' of around 3cm.

 

If you're flying a 737NG in the sim, no matter how good a 'quality' a joystick is, you're input movements are never going to be anywhere near as realistic with a joystick, as with a yoke.  Even though the yoke's axes lengths aren't accurate with a real 737's aileron yoke travel, you're going to be a heck of a lot closer than with a joystick.

 

There's also the fact that most people are going to have their joystick placed to the left or right of their monitor, or seating position.  Whilst this is good for flying the Airbuses, it's very unrealistic for flying a yoke-based aircraft, or even a stick-based aircraft where the stick is located centrally; between the pilot's legs.   A Saitek or CH yoke is always going to be located in front of you - as it would be in a real aircraft.

 

I simply could not imagine flying the NGX with a joystick, for this reason.  Nor even a C172.

 

I own a Saitek Yoke and consider it essential for all yoke-airplane flying,   I also own a Logitech Atk3 joystick, which I use for 'stick' planes and of course, the Aerosoft Airbuses. :smile:

[Michael63 20]

I am surprised, that in this thread, I am the only one for the yoke. Maybe the previous versions were worst in terms of quality?

Have had the Saitek Cessna Yoke and rudder pedals for 2 years and would never go back to a Yoke not even to fly the Airbus. Still works solid after 2 years wear and tear daily.

[ajpongress 467]

I believe even a lower cost (Saitek or CH Products) yoke is better than a high end joystick - if you're flying aircraft that have a yoke.

The control surfaces are the same on a Boeing or Airbus...not sure why you would think a $100 yoke would be better then an expensive and very nice force feedback stick.

If it's immersion, that's one thing. But from a control view, higher end hardware is always going to be easier to control the aircraft.

[xplanery 250]

 

 

The control surfaces are the same on a Boeing or Airbus...not sure why you would think a $100 yoke would be better then an expensive and very nice force feedback stick.

 

Comparing yokes and joysticks is like comparing apples and oranges. No matter the price and quality flying a Boeing with joystick will always feel wrong, just like flying an Airbus using a yoke does. 

 

I say get them both, cheap joysticks & yokes like Logitech 3D Pro and Saitek Pro Flight Yoke offer perfectly adequate experience for ordinary flight simming.